Legislature(1999 - 2000)

04/22/1999 06:45 PM House FIN

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
LOG                                                                                                                             
SPEAKER                                                                                                                         
DISCUSSION                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
TAPE HFC 99 - 100                                                                                                               
SIDE 1                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
000                                                                                                                             
CO-CHAIR MULDER                                                                                                                 
Convened the House Finance Committee                                                                                            
meeting at 6:45 P.M.                                                                                                            
104                                                                                                                             
CO-CHAIR MULDER                                                                                                                 
Stated that each approach has merit.                                                                                            
Each approach has excellent points.  He                                                                                         
introduced Representative Hudson,                                                                                               
Representative Lisa Murkowski,                                                                                                  
Representative Carl Morgan and                                                                                                  
Representative Gail Phillips                                                                                                    
194                                                                                                                             
REPRESENTATIVE BILL                                                                                                             
HUDSON                                                                                                                          
Introduced the All Alaska Working Plan.                                                                                         
He spoke to the packet of material                                                                                              
distributed to Committee members.  [Copy                                                                                        
on File].  Additionally, a copy of HB 156                                                                                       
was distributed. [See Attachment #1].                                                                                           
324                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Spoke to the presentation provided by the                                                                                       
All Alaskan Plan.  He noted that R.                                                                                             
Phillips would review the assumptions of                                                                                        
how the plans work.  Additionally, R.                                                                                           
Murkowski will explain how it would work                                                                                        
on the dividend fund and the impact to                                                                                          
that fund.                                                                                                                      
425                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Stated that the plan was formed by 12                                                                                           
members of the House and represents a                                                                                           
wide variety of areas, both rural and                                                                                           
urban areas of the State.                                                                                                       
477                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Explained the process of the group and                                                                                          
how the plan came into being.  Initially,                                                                                       
was functional research for the plan.                                                                                           
Then the research began for the plan.                                                                                           
The plan borrowed ideas from all research                                                                                       
in the State.  In the beginning looked at                                                                                       
the Governor's plan.  The governor                                                                                              
proposed the personal income tax.  Also,                                                                                        
the groups looked at Dave Rose's plan.                                                                                          
The group looked at the Minorities                                                                                              
suggestions.                                                                                                                    
656                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Continued explaining the Alaskan Plan.                                                                                          
Also, the treaties of HB 126 were                                                                                               
included.  The bill must be passed this                                                                                         
session.  The flexibility of achieving                                                                                          
the full merits will bring billions of                                                                                          
dollars of income.  There has been                                                                                              
wonderful cooperation with Jim Kelly of                                                                                         
the PFD.                                                                                                                        
749                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Stated that Legislative Finance helped                                                                                          
with the formation of this plan.  This                                                                                          
plan is an endowment plan.  It was agreed                                                                                       
that there would be no more overriding to                                                                                       
reach the shortfall.  There needs to be a                                                                                       
revenue stream for the people at large                                                                                          
and a plan that will sustain and grow our                                                                                       
assets.                                                                                                                         
822                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
There is a need for a long-term plan.                                                                                           
The graph shows an improvement.  The plan                                                                                       
is needed because not one general funds                                                                                         
budget has stayed on its own since 1972.                                                                                        
With continued budget cuts it will                                                                                              
require $1.2 billion from the savings                                                                                           
account.  At this pace, we will exhaust                                                                                         
the PFD by 2003.  Action needs to be                                                                                            
taken now.  If no action is taken the PFD                                                                                       
will decrease and disappear.                                                                                                    
935                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Spoke to the possibility of an income                                                                                           
tax.  A 5% income tax would leave the                                                                                           
state short.  The majority of the public                                                                                        
rejects all these measures.  The                                                                                                
Legislature must devise a new plan this                                                                                         
session.  [Read from attachment].                                                                                               
990                                                                                                                             
REPRESENTATIVE GAIL                                                                                                             
PHILLIPS                                                                                                                        
Spoke to the plan.  All the various plans                                                                                       
and the endowment mechanism will fare                                                                                           
well.  The All Alaskan Plan is an                                                                                               
endowment plan.  Read from attachment                                                                                           
statements.  [See Attachment #2].                                                                                               
1521                                                                                                                            
REPRESENTATIVE LISA                                                                                                             
MURKOWSKI                                                                                                                       
Spoke to the All-Alaska Plan-Using Spring                                                                                       
forecast for oil prices.  [See attachment                                                                                       
for full testimony].  She referenced the                                                                                        
handout in Members packet.  [See                                                                                                
Attachment #3].                                                                                                                 
1622                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Murkowski                                                                                                                       
The continued pay out of the dividend is                                                                                        
not certain under the current system.                                                                                           
The possible reversible of the fund could                                                                                       
impact the future dividend.                                                                                                     
1713                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Murkowski                                                                                                                       
Constitutional Budget Reserve will be                                                                                           
exhausted without a plan there will no                                                                                          
longer be a dividend.                                                                                                           
1748                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
The Plan closes the fiscal gap and will                                                                                         
provide sustained funding for Alaska's                                                                                          
needs.  The legislation has been provided                                                                                       
to the House Finance committee in hopes                                                                                         
of creating a final proposal to bring to                                                                                        
the people.                                                                                                                     
1806                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Noted that the two bills have been                                                                                              
distributed to committee members.  The                                                                                          
Plan members offered to overview the                                                                                            
bills.                                                                                                                          
1846                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Is the Plan have a savings account,                                                                                             
earnings from the permanent fund go into                                                                                        
that, the entire Constitutional Budget                                                                                          
Reserve goes into that account.                                                                                                 
1874                                                                                                                            
REPRESENTATIVE GAIL                                                                                                             
PHILLIPS                                                                                                                        
The Constitutional Budget Reserve will                                                                                          
grow by $100 million dollars every year                                                                                         
from settlements and it can grow or it                                                                                          
can be shut down.                                                                                                               
1902                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
How will the bill pass                                                                                                          
1909                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
It will take 30 votes.                                                                                                          
1919                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
This would be a bipartisan measure.                                                                                             
1930                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Recommend that the legislature would                                                                                            
disband the constitutional budget reserve                                                                                       
to retain a higher level of return into                                                                                         
the savings.                                                                                                                    
1961                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Stated that the charts show how the gap                                                                                         
would be filled.                                                                                                                
1974                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Explained the larger the corpus the more                                                                                        
stable the account will be over time.                                                                                           
1988                                                                                                                            
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Agreed from previous testimony.  Return                                                                                         
would 8.7% return.                                                                                                              
2003                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Foster                                                                                                                          
Thanked the group and their effort.                                                                                             
2013                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Spoke to the endowment concept.  He asked                                                                                       
if the 8% were applied to the total                                                                                             
savings account.  He asked what it would                                                                                        
be called another account.                                                                                                      
2045                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Stated that from an historic perception                                                                                         
it would be cleaner to establish a new                                                                                          
endowment account.  Total disclosure.                                                                                           
2070                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Using the PFD for the original intention.                                                                                       
2081                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
It is essentially the same as the                                                                                               
Earnings reserve Account.                                                                                                       
2097                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
By keeping it in the ERA it would                                                                                               
essentially stay in the corpus of the                                                                                           
PFD.  The PFC but outside would manage                                                                                          
it.                                                                                                                             
2124                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Suggested that it could be Constitutional                                                                                       
Budget Reserve could stay and commingled                                                                                        
and achieve and receive the same results.                                                                                       
2151                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Reason to put everything into one account                                                                                       
would keep it so that it could be                                                                                               
invested as one unit.  It would be                                                                                              
invested so that the cash can grow.                                                                                             
2180                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
It could be invested long term and                                                                                              
technically it would be available by 21                                                                                         
votes rather than 30 votes.                                                                                                     
2199                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
The public can understand it more                                                                                               
clearly.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
TAPE CHANGE HFC 99-                                                                                                             
100,  Side 2                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
000                                                                                                                             
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Davis                                                                                                                           
The dividend can not be guaranteed                                                                                              
forever.                                                                                                                        
024                                                                                                                             
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Why the assumption of the price of oil                                                                                          
044                                                                                                                             
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Agreed that it was a conservation figure,                                                                                       
and the group believes that the oil price                                                                                       
will stay that low within the near                                                                                              
future.  Making the plan work at a low                                                                                          
price and continue to pay for state                                                                                             
services and the continued Permanent                                                                                            
Fund.                                                                                                                           
121                                                                                                                             
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Did he understand correctly that the                                                                                            
dividend would stay at $1000 in the                                                                                             
future.                                                                                                                         
165                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
That is correct.  If there is not change                                                                                        
in the State's fiscal policies, financial                                                                                       
assets will disappear entirely by the                                                                                           
year 2011.                                                                                                                      
209                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Explained that it would be better to have                                                                                       
a program that works, even though the                                                                                           
dividend will go down, eventually it will                                                                                       
go up.  The same scenario will happen                                                                                           
with a flat funding and will include cuts                                                                                       
for the next five years.  In the next                                                                                           
five years, the plan will hold inflation.                                                                                       
It will allow the endowment plan to have                                                                                        
a solid start.  The plan will take                                                                                              
dedicated work.                                                                                                                 
345                                                                                                                             
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Acknowledged the work put into the plan.                                                                                        
He voiced appreciation of the conserve                                                                                          
estimate price of oil.  He listed the                                                                                           
highest preference of his district.  One                                                                                        
area that was not conservation was the                                                                                          
amount of cuts for the next five years.                                                                                         
507                                                                                                                             
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Responded to comments on cuts to the                                                                                            
dividend.  If the price of oil goes up,                                                                                         
the Legislature will have the flexibility                                                                                       
to increase the dividends.  The general                                                                                         
public has forgotten the days when our                                                                                          
checks were $400 to $500 dollars.                                                                                               
567                                                                                                                             
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Noted that his constituents have asked                                                                                          
that there not be any more cuts.  He                                                                                            
summarized that the majority of people                                                                                          
feel that the State has cut enough human                                                                                        
services.  People want the curve to be                                                                                          
turned.  The Fairbanks Assembly has asked                                                                                       
that capping occur and specifically that                                                                                        
there needs to be an income tax                                                                                                 
implemented.  Long stability should add                                                                                         
more revenue and that could happen                                                                                              
through a income tax.  There needs to be                                                                                        
more revenue up front.                                                                                                          
745                                                                                                                             
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Acknowledged that the group has gotten                                                                                          
that feedback from residents throughout                                                                                         
the state.  She emphasized that this is a                                                                                       
long-term plan.                                                                                                                 
791                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Followed up that the final curve does not                                                                                       
include the tobacco tax settlement, the                                                                                         
annual cig. Tax increase and the rental                                                                                         
car tax increase.  These are potential                                                                                          
enhancements.  He stated that it will be                                                                                        
difficult to make these proposed                                                                                                
reductions.                                                                                                                     
854                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Voiced concern that the last seven years                                                                                        
the State has been spending the savings                                                                                         
account.  Had the proposed approach been                                                                                        
taken in the last five years, this would                                                                                        
not have occurred.  This plan is a                                                                                              
working document.  It is not set in                                                                                             
concrete.  Each year it needs to be                                                                                             
addressed piece by piece.                                                                                                       
944                                                                                                                             
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Davis                                                                                                                           
Noted that his involvement in the group                                                                                         
always included flexibility.  This plan                                                                                         
could be implemented and things  can be                                                                                         
reduced and cut.  That is where the                                                                                             
flexibility of the plan happens.  The                                                                                           
revenues should be increased.  The public                                                                                       
always comes back to the dividend.  Keep                                                                                        
a sharp eye on spending and new revenue                                                                                         
sources.  This would diversify the                                                                                              
economy.                                                                                                                        
1059                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Grussendorf                                                                                                                     
He stated that there has not been a                                                                                             
budget that has stood on its own since                                                                                          
1992.  He spoke to the Constitutional                                                                                           
Budget Reserve, which is meant to be used                                                                                       
that way.  He spoke to the enhancements                                                                                         
that had been included.  He asked if the                                                                                        
cuts would be to the general funds or                                                                                           
other funding sources.                                                                                                          
1146                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Replied that would be to the general                                                                                            
funds.  There has not been increased to                                                                                         
business license since 1949.  When a plan                                                                                       
is developed, one includes as many                                                                                              
thoughts as possible to consider.  There                                                                                        
needs to be lost of flexibility.                                                                                                
1204                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Grussendorf                                                                                                                     
Asked if the legislation was a serious                                                                                          
draft.                                                                                                                          
1217                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Stated that they only wanted to put a                                                                                           
plan together for the finance Committee                                                                                         
to consider.                                                                                                                    
1241                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Williams                                                                                                                        
Suggested that the plan was good                                                                                                
1253                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Referenced the Capital Budget.  He stated                                                                                       
that there were aggressive projects in                                                                                          
the Capital budget.  He thought with                                                                                            
those projects, there would not be a lot                                                                                        
of headway on the plan.                                                                                                         
1297                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Phillips                                                                                                                        
Stated that the State needs to take a                                                                                           
long-range goal.  A goal must be                                                                                                
established so as to make a long-term                                                                                           
commitment.  That will take a different                                                                                         
philosophy of how to do government. [See                                                                                        
Attachment #4].                                                                                                                 
1352                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Appreciated that concept and asked that                                                                                         
there be consensus in that direction.                                                                                           
The practical problem is how to reduce                                                                                          
the budget.  Even with privatization,                                                                                           
there is little possibility of reducing                                                                                         
the budget.  All the fat has been                                                                                               
squeezed out of the system.  Setting                                                                                            
priorities requires that less should be                                                                                         
done.                                                                                                                           
1442                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Hudson                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Need to establish a sustainable source of                                                                                       
money.  He suggested the bond board.  The                                                                                       
entire general obligation bonds are                                                                                             
tools.                                                                                                                          
1529                                                                                                                            
WILSON CONDON,                                                                                                                  
COMMISSIONER,                                                                                                                   
DEPARTMENT OF                                                                                                                   
REVENUE                                                                                                                         
Provided a handout on the Balanced Budget                                                                                       
Plan for Alaska.  [Copy on File].  He                                                                                           
introduced Chris Phillips, Investment                                                                                           
Officer, Department of Revenue.                                                                                                 
1722                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Agreed that there needs to be a plan for                                                                                        
Alaska's future.  He spoke to the current                                                                                       
oil prices, which closed at $16.50/bbl                                                                                          
today.  Even with higher oil prices, the                                                                                        
Constitutional Budget Reserve will go                                                                                           
into a deficit in the future.                                                                                                   
Commissioner Condon provided an overview                                                                                        
of the handout and how holding the line                                                                                         
would affect the State's long term                                                                                              
economical future.  He stated that the                                                                                          
oil price projected by the State is $1 a                                                                                        
barrel more than that projected by the                                                                                          
All Alaska Plan.                                                                                                                
1835                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
The state has gone from 2 million barrels                                                                                       
a day in 1988; now at 1 million barrels a                                                                                       
day at this time.  There will be four or                                                                                        
five years at the 1 million barrels a                                                                                           
day.                                                                                                                            
1921                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Explained that even if they have mis-                                                                                           
guessed on oil prices and they are higher                                                                                       
action still needs to be taken now.                                                                                             
1945                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Reviewed five principles that should be                                                                                         
included in restructuring state finance,                                                                                        
as contained in page 7.                                                                                                         
2002                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Reviewed page 8, concluded that a broad-                                                                                        
based tax is needed to preserve a healthy                                                                                       
dividend.                                                                                                                       
2036                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Noted that many of his constituents are                                                                                         
not highly impacted by the dividend, but                                                                                        
would be impacted by an income tax. He                                                                                          
questioned why the government would give                                                                                        
out money on one hand and take it back                                                                                          
with the other.                                                                                                                 
2104                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Observed that there are individuals that                                                                                        
feel strongly about both the dividend and                                                                                       
the tax. He noted that the permanent fund                                                                                       
dividend                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
(TAPE CHANGE, HFC 99                                                                                                            
- 101, Side 1).                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
000                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Noted that total use of the permanent                                                                                           
fund dividend would mean that non-                                                                                              
residents would not contribute anything                                                                                         
on money made in Alaska                                                                                                         
103                                                                                                                             
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Asked the percentage of people would fall                                                                                       
into this category.                                                                                                             
135                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Noted that 10 to 11 percent of Alaska's                                                                                         
workforce would fall into this category.                                                                                        
165                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Discussed page 9, use of permanent fund                                                                                         
earnings (PFE). The Governor's plan                                                                                             
recommends a transfer of $4 billion in                                                                                          
PFE to a separate fund CBRF. He noted                                                                                           
that the Governor favors a broad general                                                                                        
tax. He added that the Governor                                                                                                 
recognizes the need for responsible                                                                                             
budget cuts.                                                                                                                    
340                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Reviewed page 10. Noted that there are                                                                                          
other approaches that could be used to                                                                                          
balance the budget. Emphasized that only                                                                                        
a balanced approach that includes PFE, a                                                                                        
broad-based tax, and budget cuts would                                                                                          
preserve a sizable permanent fund                                                                                               
dividend.                                                                                                                       
492                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Further discussed the need for a broad-                                                                                         
based tax.                                                                                                                      
533                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Discussed page 11, principles on which                                                                                          
the Governor is weighing balanced budgets                                                                                       
plans.                                                                                                                          
668                                                                                                                             
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Observed that he is opposed to an income                                                                                        
tax, but appreciates the Governor's                                                                                             
putting it on the table.                                                                                                        
721                                                                                                                             
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Noted that 10 to 12 percent of the                                                                                              
workforce is from out of state. He asked                                                                                        
if it the data is broken down by                                                                                                
industry.                                                                                                                       
753                                                                                                                             
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Responded that an estimation could be                                                                                           
made from Department of Labor data.                                                                                             
788                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Stressed that assumptions need to be                                                                                            
agreed on.                                                                                                                      
868                                                                                                                             
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Spoke to the unfair depiction of the                                                                                            
Legislature costing the hundreds of                                                                                             
millions of dollars.                                                                                                            
932                                                                                                                             
CHRIS PHILLIPS,                                                                                                                 
SENIOR INVESTMENT                                                                                                               
OFFICIER, DEPARTMENT                                                                                                            
OF REVENUE                                                                                                                      
Refuted that information.  The                                                                                                  
Constitutional Budget Reserve and cash                                                                                          
flow needs are evaluated often.  Assets                                                                                         
in equities were pulled in December and                                                                                         
were placed into the bond fund and the                                                                                          
cash fund.  Those assets were moved                                                                                             
because there was not a five-year                                                                                               
horizon.                                                                                                                        
1005                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
That action was based on cash flow.                                                                                             
1027                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Stated that it all started seven years                                                                                          
ago.  He was speaking of the equity                                                                                             
allocation in statute.                                                                                                          
1071                                                                                                                            
Representative G.                                                                                                               
Davis                                                                                                                           
Asked if there was a cap on a sizable                                                                                           
PERMANENT FUND DIVIDEND.                                                                                                        
1083                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
A sizeable dividend will be a political                                                                                         
decision.                                                                                                                       
1098                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Noted that in the plan, the dividend                                                                                            
would be $1200 dollars and then growing.                                                                                        
He asked if that was correct.                                                                                                   
1122                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Agreed that would be in the medium case.                                                                                        
1133                                                                                                                            
Ms. Phillips                                                                                                                    
Stated that would tend to be depending on                                                                                       
how it was calculated.  It would                                                                                                
naturally fall and would be around $1400                                                                                        
dollars.                                                                                                                        
1170                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Spoke to the endowment concept and asked                                                                                        
if it was acceptable to the Governor.                                                                                           
1207                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Stated that it was.  He commented that                                                                                          
the Governor would look closely at the                                                                                          
plan and conclude that a rolling average                                                                                        
of the market value would be used to                                                                                            
establish the pay off.  Otherwise, there                                                                                        
will be volatility and that is                                                                                                  
attractive.  Additionally, the Committee                                                                                        
should think about the comfort with the                                                                                         
implied equity allocation in the high 5%.                                                                                       
That will place the State in the high 60%                                                                                       
equity percentile.  The Board of Trustees                                                                                       
University would find itself in a                                                                                               
different situation.  The potential                                                                                             
volatility to reach that return.                                                                                                
1346                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Mentioned the concern regarding the                                                                                             
assumptions.                                                                                                                    
1363                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Williams                                                                                                                        
Broad general tax for enhanced revenue                                                                                          
sources.  Would the out of state people                                                                                         
would that be constitutional.                                                                                                   
1418                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Did not know until that would go to                                                                                             
court.  The tax was set a few years ago.                                                                                        
Alaskans who receive the dividend pay                                                                                           
nothing.  In order to raise the revenue                                                                                         
needed, there is no way to structure                                                                                            
that.                                                                                                                           
1494                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Like to have defined quantities.                                                                                                
Sizeable dividends.  Reasonable                                                                                                 
deductions can be defined in many ways.                                                                                         
A dollar figure needs to be placed on                                                                                           
reductions.                                                                                                                     
1531                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Grussendorf                                                                                                                     
Spoke to the assumptions that are crucial                                                                                       
to the Alaska Plan.  He asked if                                                                                                
Commissioner Condon agreed with some of                                                                                         
those assumptions that the Department                                                                                           
agreed with the cost of oil.                                                                                                    
1570                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Yes agreed hesitantly with the                                                                                                  
assumptions.  He stated that they are                                                                                           
more conservative than the Governor has                                                                                         
been on the oil price.  Additionally,                                                                                           
that plan is more aggressive in terms of                                                                                        
the financial returns.  All projections                                                                                         
done by Department of Revenue have been                                                                                         
7.4%.  The All Alaska plan was based on a                                                                                       
8% projection.  Some of the is a                                                                                                
judgement call.  He acknowledged that                                                                                           
this would be worked through.                                                                                                   
1693                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Echoed the comments to make an apples to                                                                                        
apples comparison between these two plans                                                                                       
and as the have evolved.                                                                                                        
1732                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Key assumption is growth and relates to                                                                                         
budget cuts.  Responsible plan relates to                                                                                       
cuts in the last five years.                                                                                                    
1768                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
A flat budget discussion.  Over the                                                                                             
longer term there will be a need to find                                                                                        
a way to be more efficient so that the                                                                                          
total expenditure can stay level.  He                                                                                           
stated that he believes that making                                                                                             
investment in kids is a lot less                                                                                                
expensive than taking care of prisons.                                                                                          
1844                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Could a flat budget take care of U of A.                                                                                        
1872                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Asked about the capital budget for the                                                                                          
Governor.                                                                                                                       
1883                                                                                                                            
Commissioner Condon                                                                                                             
Stated that it was the same as the last                                                                                         
number of years.                                                                                                                
1898                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Foster                                                                                                                          
Thanked the Commissioner.                                                                                                       
1920                                                                                                                            
Representative Moses                                                                                                            
Spoke to the work force of the state and                                                                                        
how it is different that other states.                                                                                          
There are many people in the State that                                                                                         
are only seasonal workers.  He pointed                                                                                          
out the transient workers.  People do not                                                                                       
want to pay taxes and want to keep having                                                                                       
their dividends.  Many people plan to                                                                                           
leave the State when they get their "nest                                                                                       
egg".  They do not care about the future                                                                                        
of Alaska.                                                                                                                      
2006                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Spoke to residency time requirement.                                                                                            
2016                                                                                                                            
Representative Moses                                                                                                            
Change the name to the Real Alaska Plan.                                                                                        
2057                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Austerman                                                                                                                       
Referenced the letter he distributed                                                                                            
regarding an endowment possibility.                                                                                             
2100                                                                                                                            
FRANK DILLION,                                                                                                                  
(TESTIFIED VIA                                                                                                                  
TELECONFERENCE),                                                                                                                
ALASKA TRUCKING                                                                                                                 
ASSOCIATION,                                                                                                                    
ANCHORAGE                                                                                                                       
Provided recommendations made by the                                                                                            
Alaska Trucking Association.  Board                                                                                             
members have reviewed the basic fiscal                                                                                          
gap allocations.  The focus of the review                                                                                       
was on what the plans focus was.  The                                                                                           
most acceptable plan was the All Alaska                                                                                         
Plan.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
TAPE CHANGE, HFC 99-                                                                                                            
101, Side 2                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
000                                                                                                                             
Mr. Dillon                                                                                                                      
Continued that the ATA endorses the All                                                                                         
Alaskan Plan.  This will make state                                                                                             
government more efficient.  The plan                                                                                            
could several years to implement.  This                                                                                         
would put the State on a reasonable path                                                                                        
to addressing the economic problems.                                                                                            
Does not support putting this to a vote                                                                                         
of the public.                                                                                                                  
143                                                                                                                             
RALPH SAMUELS,                                                                                                                  
(TESTIFIED VIA                                                                                                                  
TELECONFERENCE),                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN, ANCHORAGE                                                                                                             
CHAMBER OF COMMERCE,                                                                                                            
ANCHORAGE                                                                                                                       
Asked that a plan be implemented this                                                                                           
session.  Reduce state spending based on                                                                                        
a model that produces results.                                                                                                  
Privatization should be examined                                                                                                
everywhere.  The state needs to get the                                                                                         
confidence of the Alaskan people.  Some                                                                                         
programs must be phased out.  Public                                                                                            
sector versus private sector wages should                                                                                       
be comparable.  Revenue equation revenues                                                                                       
between PERMANENT FUND DIVIDEND and                                                                                             
Earnings reserve.  Should continue to use                                                                                       
the Constitutional Budget Reserve.  The                                                                                         
use of GO debts carefully considered.                                                                                           
Lastly consider a broad-based tax.                                                                                              
623                                                                                                                             
Representative                                                                                                                  
Foster                                                                                                                          
Thanked the speaker.  It is not as simple                                                                                       
as it looks.  In the village area                                                                                               
essentials are different in each election                                                                                       
district (40) that is related to health                                                                                         
and safety.                                                                                                                     
675                                                                                                                             
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Commented on the impact of taxes.  There                                                                                        
are constitutional mandate places on the                                                                                        
state.                                                                                                                          
760                                                                                                                             
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Delicate economy and is not broad based.                                                                                        
The economy will be in a turmoil for the                                                                                        
next year.                                                                                                                      
817                                                                                                                             
Mr. Samuels                                                                                                                     
Commented on previous comments.  No one                                                                                         
wants to be cuts.  Everyone wants to make                                                                                       
sure that they are getting something for                                                                                        
their dollar.  Need to establish a goal.                                                                                        
Across the board cuts does not work well.                                                                                       
965                                                                                                                             
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Stated that it is a delicate decision in                                                                                        
making reductions.                                                                                                              
984                                                                                                                             
KEN FREEMAN,                                                                                                                    
(TESTIFIED VIA                                                                                                                  
TELECONFERENCE),                                                                                                                
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR,                                                                                                             
RESOURCE DEVLEOPMENT                                                                                                            
COUNCIL, ANCHORAGE                                                                                                              
Gave a brief overview of the Resource                                                                                           
Development Council (RDC).                                                                                                      
1051                                                                                                                            
Mr. Freeman                                                                                                                     
Expressed support for a long-term                                                                                               
solution.                                                                                                                       
1105                                                                                                                            
Mr. Freeman                                                                                                                     
Noted that there are a lot of good plans.                                                                                       
RDC supports the following steps in the                                                                                         
order that they are provided, responsible                                                                                       
reductions in state government                                                                                                  
(performance standards, alternative ways                                                                                        
of delivery such as privatization);                                                                                             
diversification through the use of PFE;                                                                                         
and implementation of a broad based tax.                                                                                        
There is more support for a sales tax                                                                                           
than an income tax. Emphasized that a                                                                                           
combination of tools is needed to solve                                                                                         
the problem.                                                                                                                    
1261                                                                                                                            
CHERYL FRASCA,                                                                                                                  
(TESTIFIED VIA                                                                                                                  
TELECONFERENCE),                                                                                                                
FISCAL POLICY                                                                                                                   
COUNCIL, ANCHORAGE                                                                                                              
She gave a brief overview of the Fiscal                                                                                         
Policy Council. She emphasized that it is                                                                                       
important that any plan retains the value                                                                                       
of the financial assets. She provide                                                                                            
members with a copy of their plan                                                                                               
(attachment 1)                                                                                                                  
1395                                                                                                                            
Ms. Frasca                                                                                                                      
Discussed page 4.                                                                                                               
1434                                                                                                                            
Ms. Frasca                                                                                                                      
Stressed that the Council is ready to                                                                                           
help.                                                                                                                           
1451                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Asked if there is data on the All Alaskan                                                                                       
Plan.                                                                                                                           
1466                                                                                                                            
Ms. Frasca                                                                                                                      
Explained that the value in 2010 would be                                                                                       
the same as it is today.                                                                                                        
1479                                                                                                                            
Representative J.                                                                                                               
Davies                                                                                                                          
Stressed that there is a shock absorber.                                                                                        
1494                                                                                                                            
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Agreed.                                                                                                                         
1499                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Grussendorf                                                                                                                     
Referred to page 2. He asked if the group                                                                                       
has ranked taxes.                                                                                                               
1524                                                                                                                            
Ms. Frasca                                                                                                                      
Stated that the Council acknowledged that                                                                                       
the All Alaska Plan proposes some new                                                                                           
taxes. She noted that it reimposes the                                                                                          
school tax.                                                                                                                     
1553                                                                                                                            
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
Stated that if the permanent fund                                                                                               
dividend was used as a shock absorber                                                                                           
there would be a correlation between the                                                                                        
size of the dividend.                                                                                                           
1607                                                                                                                            
Ms. Frasca                                                                                                                      
Noted that it is new economic activity                                                                                          
that does not bring a return to the state                                                                                       
treasury with out a broad base or income                                                                                        
tax.                                                                                                                            
1634                                                                                                                            
Vice-Chair Bunde                                                                                                                
Noted that the availability of additional                                                                                       
state  land would result in the need for                                                                                        
additional services.                                                                                                            
1688                                                                                                                            
ARLISS STURGELEWSKI,                                                                                                            
(TESTIFIED VIA                                                                                                                  
TELECONFERENCE),                                                                                                                
ANCHORAGE                                                                                                                       
Noted her appreciation of all of those                                                                                          
involved.                                                                                                                       
1706                                                                                                                            
Representative                                                                                                                  
Foster                                                                                                                          
Expressed frustration that in his six                                                                                           
terms he has seen numerous legislators                                                                                          
come and go. During this time there has                                                                                         
been little agreement on any plan. He                                                                                           
noted the instability of the system. He                                                                                         
questioned if the ability to design a                                                                                           
long-range plan exists. He maintained                                                                                           
that he spends his time defending himself                                                                                       
and his people.                                                                                                                 
1799                                                                                                                            
Co-Chair Mulder                                                                                                                 
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                     
The meeting adjourned at 9:44 p.m.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
* [ATTACHMENT #1].                                                                                                              
All-Alaskan Plan Finance Committee Presentation                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Today we have provided you with the following materials:                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1. Sponsor statement                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2. The All-Alaskan Plan with color copies of the plan's revised                                                                 
spreadsheets                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The next 3 documents have been previously presented to the committee,                                                           
and you may already have these:                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3. "The Case for Increased Flexibility: HB156"                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4. "Alaska Permanent Fund"                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
5. "Alaska's Public Finances"                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Over the next 45 minutes we will make the following presentation:                                                               
? Hudson Presentation: how the working group began, how the                                                                     
concept of an endowment was adopted, how the plan works in                                                                      
general terms, the need for action now, etc.                                                                                    
? Phillips Presentation: review the major assumptions used in                                                                   
our endowment model, and a more specific explanation on how                                                                     
the endowment works.                                                                                                            
? Murkowski:  Explain to you the effects on the dividend under                                                                  
three different scenarios.                                                                                                      
? Questions from Committee members                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
The All-Alaskan Plan is the product of 10-12 deeply concerned House                                                             
members who believe we must act this year.  These members broadly                                                               
represent all regions of Alaska- Hence: "All-Alaskan"                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
The process was mostly kitchen-table discussions and dividing up the                                                            
research.                                                                                                                       
5-6 worked on functional research identifying the essential                                                                     
services of government                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
  5-6 worked on the revenue side                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
The plan didn't hesitate to borrow other ideas.  Looked at:                                                                     
? Governors $4 billion-unrealized & personal income tax                                                                         
? Dave Rose's-Rose Plan                                                                                                         
? Minority and Majority thoughts                                                                                                
? Cremo Plan                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Took 2 months to reach our groups approval or comfort level.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The plan drew upon several documents-                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
? Alaska Public Finances (prepared and presented by Commissioner of                                                             
Revenue, Will Condon)                                                                                                           
? Alaska Permanent Fund (a treatise on what elements and general                                                                
history of the PF was and is)                                                                                                   
? APFC case for increasing investment flexibility-HB 156 (which                                                                 
formed the basis for my vote to amend HB 156 to the 10% increased                                                               
asset allocation.)  This is a must pass bill!!!                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Our team conferred with Jim Kelly of the PF Corp. and our own finance                                                           
analysts-Phil Oakuson and David Teal as well as Legislative Legal                                                               
Tamara Cook.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Our adopted concept was finally- an endowment plan.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
We agreed:                                                                                                                      
? No more overriding reliance on macro cutting to meet the $1 billion                                                           
shortfall!                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
? Need to find a plan that would sustain and grow our financial                                                                 
assets                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
? The need to develop a sustainable, reliable flow of income from our                                                           
financial assets:  PF, CBR and ERA                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
? A plan that looks long-term and puts all options on the table,                                                                
including potential enhancements for the future.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
? A plan that would be based on conservative figures                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
WHY DO WE NEED A PLAN?                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
? Because not one GF budget has stood on it's own since 1992.  Over                                                             
$4.3 billion has had to be borrowed from our savings account, the                                                               
CBR, to balance those annual budgets despite over $275 million in                                                               
spending cuts, plus eating inflation over these same years.                                                                     
? Because even with continued budget cuts, we will have to withdraw                                                             
another $1.2 billion from our savings account this year and $1.0                                                                
billion each year thereafter to balance our operating and capital                                                               
budgets.  At this pace we will completely exhaust our CBR by 2003                                                               
and will be forced to turn to our Permanent Fund Reserves and major                                                             
new taxes, including both a Personal Income Tax and probably a                                                                  
Statewide Sales Tax, to balance our budget.                                                                                     
? Since PFD's are based upon P.F. earnings, if we take no action, we                                                            
can expect the PFD's to decrease and eventually disappear as we are                                                             
forced to turn to PF earnings once we have exhausted the CBR.  Rep.                                                             
Murkowski will speak in more detail on this later in our                                                                        
presentation.                                                                                                                   
? Adoption of an Income Tax, as some have suggested, cannot bridge                                                              
the gap.  An income tax is estimated to generate a maximum of $350                                                              
million per year.  That still leaves almost $850 million short!                                                                 
? A 5% statewide sales tax would produce only $300 million, still                                                               
leaving us $900 million short.                                                                                                  
? Since a majority of the public appears to reject either of these                                                              
tax measures and it would be impossible to reduce the budget by                                                                 
even $100 million, let alone $1 billion, we believe the legislature                                                             
must devise and implement a new plan, and implement it this                                                                     
session.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
I'm going to turn this over to Representative Phillips, who will                                                                
explain the endowment plan and the assumptions we used in our model.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
*ATTACHMENT #2-REPRESENTATIVE GAIL PHILLIPS                                                                                     
Brief Introduction and Comments                                                                                                 
? Thank you for inviting us to present our plan                                                                                 
? My part of the presentation today is to go over the major                                                                     
assumptions contained in the All-Alaskan Plan.                                                                                  
? Phil Okeson from Legislative Finance is also here if there are                                                                
questions requiring his expertise.                                                                                              
? We know that in the end, you will examine all the various plans                                                               
under study to a standard set of assumptions so you can compare                                                                 
them and see how reasonable and sustainable they are.                                                                           
? We believe the All-Alaskan Plan, with its endowment mechanism, will                                                           
fare well in that process - even if you run it over 20 years and I                                                              
encourage you to do so.                                                                                                         
THE ALL-ALASKAN PLAN IS AN ENDOWMENT PLAN                                                                                       
? Our plan stops the raid on Alaska's SAVINGS accounts and begins                                                               
funding part of government as well as ongoing Permanent Fund                                                                    
Dividends from our endowment payout of our considerable savings                                                                 
accounts.                                                                                                                       
? The plan does not take one dime from the corpus of the Permanent                                                              
Fund                                                                                                                            
? The plan would legislatively create the Alaska Income Account,                                                                
which will replace and receive the balance in the Earning Reserve                                                               
and the Constitutional Budget Reserve.  The Alaska Income Account                                                               
will be managed as an endowment fund by the Permanent Fund and will                                                             
start out at $5.9 billion.                                                                                                      
? Net income from the Permanent Fund will accrue to this account as                                                             
well.                                                                                                                           
? The endowment works because we never "eat" the principle of our                                                               
accounts.  In fact we build both over time and that growth produces                                                             
a steady growth in income revenues to fill our $ billion dollar gap                                                             
and maintain a healthy Permanent Fund Dividend for years to come.                                                               
? If members will please turn to "revised" color spreadsheet in your                                                            
packet.                                                                                                                         
First - Revenue Assumptions                                                                                                     
? Oil Prices - the working group wanted to take a very conservative                                                             
stand when it came to oil prices in this plan and therefore we used                                                             
$13.50 per barrel for oil for the entire 10 years.  If member look                                                              
across the spreadsheet you will see that the Spring Forecast is                                                                 
shown right above our models price of $13.50 and you can get an                                                                 
idea of the differences each year.  It is substantial - varying                                                                 
from just 7 cents a barrel in FT00 to $7.41 cents a barrel in FY11.                                                             
? If oil prices increase above the model projections of $13.50 per                                                              
barrel, or if Alaska brings on a new gas line or an increase in                                                                 
crude oil production, our plan could fulfill Alaska's fiscal needs,                                                             
including the dividend, forever.                                                                                                
? Production Volume - while we did not adopt the spring forecast as                                                             
far as prices, we did use the lower production numbers contained in                                                             
the Spring Forecast - so we have a common element here.                                                                         
Turning to Market Assumptions                                                                                                   
? Permanent Fund total return - we use 8.25% return for all assets of                                                           
the All-Alaskan Plan which includes, the CBR, the new Alaska Income                                                             
Account and the Corpus of the Permanent Fund itself.  In our                                                                    
initial discussions with Permanent Fund management they feel                                                                    
comfortable with this rate of return.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Also, as Rep. Hudson noted, and as the materials you have before                                                                
you suggest, this return would likely increase if we grant the                                                                  
Permanent Fund Corporation the flexibility they have requested in                                                               
HB156 - they estimate 8.69% could be returned.                                                                                  
Inflation Assumptions                                                                                                           
? General Inflation is 3% for all years                                                                                         
? Agency expenditures, Formula Programs, School Expenditures, and the                                                           
Capital Budget are held "flat" for five years and then increase by                                                              
2% each year thereafter.                                                                                                        
Population Growth Assumptions                                                                                                   
? We also increase School Expenditures by 2.65% in FY00 and then by                                                             
1.5% each year thereafter to account for growth.                                                                                
? And, the population receiving dividends is increased by 1.6% a year                                                           
? Inflation Proofing Assumptions - this area shows 0 because our                                                                
endowment payout method automatically inflation proofs.                                                                         
Endowment Assumptions                                                                                                           
? The payout from the endowment begins at 5.55% in FY00, goes to                                                                
5.69% in FY01, and then is set at 5.75% until FY11 at which time it                                                             
stabilizes at 5.25%. We believe that this is a sustainable amount.                                                              
? In our initial discussions with Permanent Fund management they feel                                                           
comfortable with this rate of payout - particularly if they get the                                                             
flexibility requested in HB 156.                                                                                                
? As you know, the difference between this endowment payout and the                                                             
earnings of our savings accounts described earlier (8.25%) is left                                                              
in our savings accounts for inflation proofing.                                                                                 
? As stated in the handout before you "The Case for Increased                                                                   
Flexibility" an income distribution using POMV or "percent of                                                                   
market value" like the All-Alaskan Plan has many advantages.  It                                                                
provides more predictability and stability.  It helps disconnect                                                                
investment decisions from short-term expenditure considerations.                                                                
The Permanent Fund folks can speak to additional advantages using a                                                             
POMV distribution.                                                                                                              
? Turning to the Spreadsheet itself on the next page . . . . . .                                                                
? We show the new revenues mentioned earlier (school tax, rental car,                                                           
etc) = flexible, anything other new revenues could be place in this                                                             
fund as well.                                                                                                                   
? We (under expenditures - budget cuts) show the continuation of                                                                
general fund spending beginning with $50 million in FY00 and                                                                    
dropping to $10 million in FY04                                                                                                 
? Finally - I would like to end by drawing your attention back to the                                                           
color charts at the start of this packet.                                                                                       
? Let's look at "Alaska's Savings Accounts" to see what they look                                                               
like at the end of ten years of the All-Alaskan Plan.                                                                           
? The corpus of the Permanent Fund grows from $18.9 billion to over                                                             
$20.6 billion!                                                                                                                  
? Unrealized gains grow from $3.6 billion to over $6.5 billion!                                                                 
? The earning's reserve, now the Alaska Income Account when combined                                                            
with the Constitutional Budget Reserve - grows from $5.3 billion to                                                             
over $14.1 billion!                                                                                                             
In total, over ten years the All-Alaska Plan grows these savings                                                                
accounts from around $28 Billion dollars to over $40 billion dollars!                                                           
                                                                                                                                
I would like to end with a few comments from Mr. Scott Goldsmith's                                                              
(ISER) who has been kind enough to do an initial, independent review                                                            
of the All-Alaskan Plan:                                                                                                        
? "Using the base case scenario, it does a good job of sustaining the                                                           
value of financial assets.  This is due to the fact that all                                                                    
financial assets are automatically inflation proofed."                                                                          
? "Recognizes the need to use all tools."                                                                                       
? "Retains flexibility in the use of earnings."                                                                                 
? "Including market value of all financial assets in the base for                                                               
withdrawal formula contributes to sustainability."                                                                              
? "Endowment rule creates potential for the Permanent Fund to earn                                                              
maximum return consistent with the risk target by adopting a                                                                    
prudent man rule for the portfolio."                                                                                            
? "Dividend and GF spending compete directly for available revenues                                                             
and this leads to accountability and public involvement in the                                                                  
allocations of scarce public resources."                                                                                        
? The other color graph we would like to highlight for you this                                                                 
evening is the one on "Dividends Per Capita" and Rep. Murkowski                                                                 
will be speaking about that shortly.                                                                                            
*ATTACHMENT #3 - REPRESENTATIVE LISA MURKOWSKI                                                                                  
Permanent Fund Dividends Per Capita - Four Scenarios                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
As was mentioned earlier, the original spreadsheet included in the                                                              
All-Alaskan Plan booklet contained an error.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
? If we look at the revised spreadsheet, (base case) and under the                                                              
assumptions that were detailed to you earlier, the permanent fund                                                               
dividend is projected to hold at $1000 for nine years and then fall                                                             
off due mostly to lower oil production.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
For the Committee, we also had Legislative Finance run three                                                                    
additional different scenarios:                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1) The first one is using the Governor's Spring Forecast - as you                                                               
can see moving to the higher oil prices secures a dividend at                                                                   
$1000 for the first ten years of this plan.                                                                                     
2) The second scenario is run with Permanent Fund Earnings adjusted                                                             
up to 8.69% to reflect passage of HB156 - which gives them                                                                      
additional flexibility.  The Dividend under this scenario is                                                                    
projected to stay at $1000 for almost seven years and then drop                                                                 
off to around $800 on year 10.                                                                                                  
3) The third scenario is with both of the above, that is using the                                                              
Spring Forecast for oil prices and higher Permanent Fund                                                                        
earnings.  This scenario also shows the dividend staying at $1000                                                               
for length of this plan.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
We think it is important to remind everyone, that even under our                                                                
current system, the continued payout of dividends is not certain. We                                                            
have been blessed with a bull equities market for many years.  The                                                              
possible reversal of this market trend, combined with the required                                                              
statutory inflation proofing of the fund and increased population                                                               
growth could also severely impact our future dividends.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Also, as you all know, if some plan is not adopted, we will continue                                                            
to spend the Constitutional Budget Reserve (CBR), and then most likely                                                          
turn to the only other pot of money readily available for                                                                       
appropriation, the Earnings Reserve.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Using over one billion dollars a year to fill the deficit, the CBR                                                              
will be exhausted in less than three years and the Earnings Reserve                                                             
itself in about two years.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
It is reasonable to say that without a plan that within five years,                                                             
the dividend will no longer exist and have no reasonable chance of                                                              
ever being resurrected.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
*ATTACHMENT #4                                                                                                                  
CLOSING COMMENTS - REPRESENTATIVE GAIL PHILLIPS                                                                                 
? The All-Alaskan Plan closes the fiscal gap, is conservative in its                                                            
estimation, and will provide sustained funding for Alaska's                                                                     
essential needs.                                                                                                                
? The time to act is now.  We must stop "eating our seed corn".                                                                 
? We have included a number of bill drafts in the green book before                                                             
you.  We looked at a number of ways to establish this endowment                                                                 
account.  With great respect for the House Finance Committee, we                                                                
have not, ourselves, introduced any of this legislation.  Instead                                                               
we offer this legislation to this Committee in hopes that it aids                                                               
you in your efforts.                                                                                                            
? Members of the All-Alaskan Plan Working Group are more than willing                                                           
to work with all of you to finalize a proposal to bring to the                                                                  
public.                                                                                                                         
? Once again, thank you for you time and interest.                                                                              

Document Name Date/Time Subjects